October 18th, 2007
John Surge says to (16:58):
Welcome everyone. We'll get started in just a moment.
John Surge says to (17:01):
The format for today’s chat is free-form Questions and Answers on any marketing-related topics. Please feel free to ask questions, share experiences and interact with each other.
John Surge says to (17:01):
Welcome! By way of introduction, my name is John Surge and I am the President of Hobbs/Herder. I have worked closely with Don and Greg over the last 17 years, and my specialty is helping agents and companies develop successful marketing strategies.
John Surge says to (17:02):
We’re glad you took time out of your day to work on your business and work on your marketing. Let's get started!
John Surge says to (17:02):
Who has the first question?
Jennifer A. Thomas says to (17:03):
How can we get buyers off the fence. Everyone is waiting for the market to drop further? Ideas???
John Surge says to (17:04):
The best strategy is to work with the sellers to get realistic about pricing. There's a standoff and the buyer's are going to win this one in the short term. Sellers need to get more realistic and that's a big part of your efforts right now.
elider says to (17:05):
Is it a good idea to order 5000 postcards and placing them on prospect vehicles?
John Surge says to (17:06):
Let's crank this thing up! No one has any questions or issues with marketing? Anything you want me to address?
vslatter says to (17:06):
John: My partner and I sell in Kauai, Hawaii. We are farming the west coast and our Island for a total of 1300 PK twice per month for 3 months now and not a lead. Pretty disappointed in this tough market. Its tough enuff getting mainlanders to innvest at this time. Any ideas to further entice buyers to Hawaii?
Jennifer A. Thomas says to (17:06):
I go out on a presentation and give the sellers a real price and they list with the an agent that gives them a higher price. Of course in no time at all they drop to the price that I suggested in the beginning.
John Surge says to (17:07):
Elider, I am not crazy about the idea of marketing a real estate professional like you would a coupon for a car wash. You need to think about better ways to connect with people.
John Surge says to (17:07):
Vslatter, what is the approach to your PowerKards to home owners? Are you attempting to attract listings or buyers with this effort? How many homes sold in the last 60 days in that 1300 home farm?
jbsr5230 says to (17:08):
Is there a way to better Market oneself toward the FSBO market.
pgwile says to admin (17:09):
John, any thoughts on sending pre-listing videos to expired or FSBO?
gord says to (17:09):
John, are most people in the Hobbs Herder system doing geographic farming or are some doing strictly people farming?
John Surge says to (17:09):
Jennifer, well, that IS a strategy. Get the listing and then work on getting the price lowered. Another strategy is to be persuasive enough to convince the seller that this is going to happen and to get them to see your way of thinking. This is where sales skills become very important.
mphineas says to (17:09):
IHi this is Michelle, am a mortgage consultant, i am working with Realtors right now who are not doing a lot of business. i want to go after working Realtors, what is the best stragegy i can use to get their attention?
vslatter says to (17:10):
John: We are trying to attract buyers from Mainland to Kauai. Our local effort is to attract listings on Island. Two different approaches.
pgwile says to admin (17:10):
Michelle offer to host lunch at their next broker open house
John Surge says to (17:10):
Jbsr, better way to market to FSBOs than what? In comparison to what? Are you seeing a continuing trend with FSBOs in your market? Most of these are drying up right now. Give me some more info and I'll see if I can help.
John Surge says to (17:12):
PGwile, our experience is that people do not watch those videos. We think it's better to offer to help the FSBO sell their own home and then be there when they decide to list with an agent, making personal contact during the process. As for Expireds, you need to hit them right when they expire. A package is good, but I'm not sold on the cost of a video. I'd almost rather see the video delivered on the web.
cookie says to (17:12):
Would you give me good ways to get my name out there that is free or doesn't cost much.
jbsr5230 says to (17:13):
John I don't see this drying up now but I have a brochure that I give to them and explain that a small 13% of the market is only captured by FSBO and try to explain to them some value added features that could help them but they don' t seem to be interested.
John Surge says to (17:13):
Michelle, first identify who they are. Then, create a marketing campaign directed at them specifically. Third, be a source of information and help to them in growing their business. Realize it will take time and consistency, but you can grow this like a snowball.
philidor says to (17:13):
Thank you
Rob Rule says to (17:14):
Got a marketing EMERGENCY that I'm panicking about. I have set up a "give-back" customer appreciation-type of deal where I am renting out a movie thater and giving out tickets to those people in my sphere/farm/client list. No sales pitch, no obligation, just a way for me to get my name out and be the good guy. It's a Sunday matinee film, so people should be able to go to it. I have about 250 tickets to get out, which means I need about 125 responses (2 tix per request). I've sent out a mailer that hit the mailboxes about a week that was about 1900 pieces. All people need to do is leave a message on my 800 number with their address and the tickets are mailed to them - they don't have to talk to anyone at all. I've gotten a grand total of two responses. I'm sending out another mailer this week, but time is running short. I've resolved that I'm going to have to pick up the phone and individually invite people to this thing which is not all bad, but I'm terribly disappointed that the mailing has generated such a low response. I made sure to highlight "free" in the big print and allowed for plenty of white space, so it's not like the offer got lost on the panel card.
Rob Rule says to (17:15):
All of this is to say - what else can I do? has anyone else tried anything like this?
John Surge says to (17:15):
Cookie, well, Jennifer is right. You have to do it the old fashioned way. I would suggest a strategic networking plan that is written out and followed just like any other marketing plan. I'd spend a little money on a logo and a slogan to establish your brand and a marketplace position.
mphineas says to (17:15):
great, thank you.
cookie says to (17:16):
what is the best ways to network?.
vslatter says to (17:17):
Perhaps my question on Hawaii marketing is too general. Based on your experience is there an average time for the campaign to begin to generate leads and is the time extended in slow markets at this?
sam chaim says to (17:18):
Re netowrking. There isn't a best way. Many options out there. The key is being out there
pgwile says to admin (17:18):
Rob- Don't panic at all. Donate the movie tickets to a school, or YMCA, build new relationships with this idea.
John Surge says to (17:18):
Rob, what's the movie? How many mailers did you send? If only one, that's never going to do it. I would suggest that you do increased promotion to local children's groups and schools, etc. The phone is not bad because you will find out why people are resisting.
cookie says to (17:18):
Thanks for your answer.
Jennifer A. Thomas says to (17:19):
I would be shocked to get results in only 3 months. This is a long trem commitment.
John Surge says to (17:19):
Cookie, find groups of like minded people and join and attend those events with a purpose to meet people. See our article on HH.com about strategic networking.
Rob Rule says to (17:19):
"Bee movie", a family type flick with Jerry Seinfield. It's animated. Sent out 1900 mailers.
vslatter says to (17:20):
Thanks Jennifer, trying to be positive here
cookie says to (17:21):
What are your thoughts on housevalues.com , homegain and other lead generating companies? Are they worth the cost?
philidor says to (17:21):
I am in the process of getting my personal brochure done. Once it is completed I understand the idea is to give it to as many people as possible. However do you recomend leaving it in homes that I am showing instead of a card and handing it to other realtors instead of a card? and why?
John Surge says to (17:21):
Vslatter, any campaign depends on market activity--if enough homes are selling to support your goals or if a competitor owns a big market share. Three months is certainly not a "long time" to develop a marketing campaign. The answer is that it's not a science--it's art and science. So, some times it takes 30 days and others it might kick in after 18 months. It takes time to build a marketing presence. I ask again, howver, how many homes sold over the last 60 days in that 1300 home farm?
John Surge says to (17:22):
Rob, I would say there's something missing in your marketing. It's more about exposure I would guess at this point.
Rob Rule says to (17:22):
Any suggestions?
John Surge says to (17:22):
Cookie, our experience is that these are extremely poor quality leads.
gord says to (17:23):
I am in British Columbia Canada and our market is still pretty good as we have not been impacted by the sub-prime issue very much at least not yet. How are the people that are doing geographical farming finding their market share. Is it increasing and having said that is the market so slow are they making a lot less money? I would like to know if your experience is that these types of agents are less impacted or not impacted at all?
art.chartier@gmail.com says to (17:24):
What's the necessary turnover ratio for a farm to be effective?
John Surge says to (17:24):
Philidor, ABSOLUTELY. Your personal brochure SHOULD replace your business card for most uses. One of the biggest mistakes agents make is being shy to hand out their brochure--because it's too big, too forward, too awkward, etc. This is a key part of branding yourself as you meet people and want them to remember you for something specific, rather than for nothing at all.
John Surge says to (17:25):
Art, at least 5%.
art.chartier@gmail.com says to (17:25):
thanks
John Surge says to (17:25):
Gord, I'm sorry, I'm not clear on your question. Please clarify.
sam chaim says to (17:26):
I have been mailing monthly to a database for 7 months and can only only identify perhaps 2 instances where referrals have been generated. Did a lot of follow up calling tin the 1st 3 months but being honest have fallen off that pace lately. I am waiitng for my HH personal Brochure . Meanwhile any suggestions for Database mailings to be more effective?
judith says to (17:26):
John, did you respond on the question about housevalues?
philidor says to (17:26):
Thank you
cookie says to (17:27):
John,thats the conclusion that I came to. I have a contract one and can't wait to cancel.I think networking is the best way for me. I will visit H.H. and look at strategic marketing.
John Surge says to (17:27):
Judith, yes, I did. Our experiene is that these are extremely low quality leads. I am all for testing.
Jennifer A. Thomas says to (17:28):
Gord, I am in Southern California. We were first impacted a few years ago by the thousands of new agents each getting one sale here and there from friends and family. This took transactions away from the established agents. We are now having trouble getting the sellers to recognize that they can no longer get the prices that we were getting two years ago.
judith says to (17:28):
John, how do you feel about a news letter?
John Surge says to (17:29):
Sam, that's the problem with calling. It's hard to keep it going. It's good though, especially to people who know you. When you do get a hold of people, ask them what they'd like to see as far as information from you. I would make sure that at least 50% of your mailers are listeds/solds or market updates or other real estate credibility building info. How big is the database and how did you develop it?
cookie says to (17:29):
jennifer, you have to educate your sellers and show statistics.
Jennifer A. Thomas says to (17:30):
Cookie, I do but some won't listen. Should I fire them or keeping chipping away at the price?
John Surge says to (17:30):
How are we doing? You folks are keeping me busy. Did I miss anyone? Want to ask a follow up?
John Surge says to (17:30):
Jennifer, you have to be bold and prepared. Bring the truth.
sam chaim says to (17:31):
currenlty about 150 and growing. It stated with my membership in the synagogeu list Iam a past president pluse general contacts built up ove rthe years. The farm piece ius realestae related produced by a major provider in our market. Question--How do you screen for deletions when you call without being rude?
vslatter says to (17:32):
John: on the island of Kauai, (approx. 60,000 pop., plus absent owners)approx. 66 homes sold since august to present. We are sending 700 PK twice a month.
gord says to (17:32):
I am wanting to know if with the slow market in most area of the US, are the realtors using that are using the Hobbs Herder System finding that they are increasing not only market share but also net income? I ask this because we are still in a market that there are many new agents coming into the business. I a declining market such as what is going on in may areas of the US are the established farming gents making more money now that they were in a good market?
John Surge says to (17:33):
Sam, 150 is not a big list. This is your sphere list and you should make mail, email and phone contact with them under a prescribed plan. I'd be careful about sending your sphere some templated real estate info rather than something from you, about you or about them. Not sure what you mean by screening for deletions?
cookie says to (17:33):
Jennifer, if the client is unreasonable, sometimes you have to walk away or get a written agreement from the client that you will lower the price in 2 weeks if nothing happens. Continue to educate. Let them know how many houses are on the market. Average price , how long its taking to sell.(etc)
Rob Rule says to (17:34):
Gord, Houstons a pretty solid market right now but I'll give the H/H testimonial - my first mailing using H/H material was in January and my sales are up 175% from last year with two months to go.
John Surge says to (17:34):
Vslatter, did thos 66 homes sell from the 700 homes you are targeting?
Jennifer A. Thomas says to (17:34):
Gord, Looking at our MLS stats. No one is making alot of money in this market.
John Surge says to (17:35):
Rob, that's great. Don't be afraid to get us to help you with something like your movie promotion. It may be worth it to get a little help on such an undertaking. I think you should continue with this type of event, though. These are important components of a holistic marketing campaign.
vslatter says to (17:35):
John: Those sales were Island wide. Are you suggesting that we change our target to the areas that are generating the most sales?
sam chaim says to (17:36):
Some people have been on since the early days and I havae a sense they are just being polite when they agree to go on the list. How long do you keep the unresponsive on the list before you clear them off. Are there some good questions to prompt them to honest about referring you?
John Surge says to (17:36):
Vslatter, I'm suggesting that you will not get blood from a stone. If homes are not selling in your market, no level of marketing will generate immediate business. Really, if you are commited to your 700-home farm, than stay committed for the long haul.
Rob Rule says to (17:37):
Sam, you've got to hit them twice a month every month and NEVER take them off - unless they ask or if they move. Check your list at least twice a year - preferably four times a year.
mdaniels says to (17:37):
Do you feel it is the kiss of death to have your name involved in short sales (as well as a difficult property to sell)?
John Surge says to (17:37):
Sam, I wouldn't worry about it. Just be honest with your sphere. Keep moving forward, try to come more from the heart and be personal with them and don't overthink it so much. Ask them questions!
vslatter says to (17:38):
Thanks John. Now how about our west coast mainland campaign to attract buyers to Hawaii. When is it time to target a new farm area?
John Surge says to (17:38):
Mdaniels, sound more like a niche to me. Why are you concerned? Anyone else see concerns?
sam chaim says to (17:39):
John ,Thanks, but isn't twice a month pushy? Can you give me some examples as to how the pieces can be suffiiciently differentiated to keep them interested as opposed to oppressed.
Rob Rule says to (17:39):
John, do you mind if I email you a copy of what I've sent for some feedback offline? This movie thing really surprised me.
judith says to (17:40):
John, what do you think about sending out a newsletter 1 a month as a beginning for a marketing idea?
John Surge says to (17:40):
Vslatter, this would be a web effort and advertising, in my view. I don't see how you could target people on the mainland. As for the farm area, selecting one is critical. You need to read our articles on selecting your farm area, but I'd say that the biggest thing is to stay consistent and committed.
mdaniels says to (17:41):
It is a niche for sure with lots of mine fields with lenders and possibility of not getting paid in the end. Perhaps a better way would be to target investors as clients....
jdixon11 says to (17:41):
John, with a limited marketing budget, please give your opinion of investing in geographic farming versus investing in upgrades to my website.
John Surge says to (17:41):
Sam, for the sphere, we recommend once per month. You could add an email to that also. I'd say a call every quarter would be fine.
Rob Rule says to (17:41):
Sam, you have to remember that mailers usually last in the prospect's mind about as long as takes to put them in the trash. If you mail twice a month, in three months you will be much more embedded in the mind of the consumer. the point is to be the first person they think about when they have a need. Once a month is just enough to keep you starving
John Surge says to (17:42):
Rob, you could send it to Bob Ruesch and he might be able to give you some input.
Rob Rule says to (17:42):
Great! Thanks!
sam chaim says to (17:42):
Thanks
vslatter says to (17:43):
For those agents in a resort area, anyone marketing to Canada with the Canadian dollar now on par with US dollar?
John Surge says to (17:43):
Mdaniels, feels like a deeper discussion. I like the idea of specialization, however.
cookie says to (17:43):
John, in our down market, do you think it is best to put your marketing dollars on the web or in print?
Jennifer A. Thomas says to (17:44):
I agree. Once a month does nothing. I know an agent that has sent out a newletter once a month for a least 9 years. She has never had a listing in that entire time. Nobody remembers her from this once a month contact.
John Surge says to (17:45):
Jdixon, I don't have enough info to give you feedback on this. I don't think your website is going to be a key for attracting listings in a farm area without corresponding direct mail or advertising. However, if you're selling resort property then maybe there's a different strategy. You might want to talk with someone in our office or attend a seminar to help you sort this out.
cookie says to (17:45):
You need a drip campaign along with the newsletter.
judith says to (17:46):
Thanks
John Surge says to (17:46):
Cookie, I really am cautious with those approaches. This or that. I like well rounded marketing programs with a specific target in mind. You do have to have some budget and staying power to be able to grab market share while everyone is contracting. Otherwise, develop your position and brand and go headlong into STRATEGIC networking.
John Surge says to (17:47):
OK, great session everyone. We're going to wrap up.
jdixon11 says to (17:47):
John, just a general question of "bang for your buck" in today's market, mail or website?
judith says to (17:47):
Thanks
art.chartier@gmail.com says to (17:47):
thanks
John Surge says to (17:47):
Some reminders: Las Vegas Gateway is coming up Nov 28-30! Are you coming?
vslatter says to (17:47):
Thanks John
sam chaim says to (17:47):
Thanks
gord says to (17:47):
My first time on. Thanks
judith says to (17:47):
yes
cookie says to (17:48):
thanks.
Charlyn Bridges says to Rob Rule (17:48):
good session
Rob Rule says to (17:48):
I'll be there - what time does the summit beginon the 27th?
John Surge says to (17:48):
If you're a Hobbs/Herder client make sure that you know you're invited to our FREE client appreciation event http://www.hobbsherder.com/summit
John Surge says to (17:48):
Rob, check the website but I think it is 1PM.
Rob Rule says to (17:49):
great - hope to see you there!
John Surge says to (17:49):
See you next month in the chat room.
John Surge says to (17:49):
Rob, look forward to seeing you at the Summit.
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