July 19th, 2007
Dennis LeBlanc says to (16:55):
Greetings to all. My name is Dennis LeBlanc, I
am Vice President and Creative Director of Hobbs/Herder.
I've been here 18 years. I'll be sitting in for John, but don't worry,
you're in good hands! I'd like to open it up to you for your questions,
but I will throw out two possible topics that I
think are very timely right now: Digital Printing and Variable Data.
These were featured in Greg's article in our recent Enews. I think
these will revolutionize Direct Mail for our clients. But I'll take
any and all marketing questions... Shoot.
Nina says to (16:57):
What do you mean by Variable Data?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (16:57):
For background, digital printing is revolutionizing the printing world and allowing many agents much more flexibility. You can print our PowerKards as you need them, rather than printing hundreds of thousands at a time and having to store them. Hobbs/Herder offers a Digital online "storefront" where you can post your messages and have it mailed directly to your farm.
becky@beckyandbrad.net says to (16:58):
what exactly do you mean by "storefront?"
shelia01 says to (16:58):
i have the 10 transactions in 90 days. Anyway to download those from the web without typing them myself?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (16:59):
Nina, Variable data is a cool technology that allows you to print your recipient's name into your PowerKard message/headline. That is, you can say: "Here's a market update prepared especially for Joe and Mary Smith." Each person gets their name on the message!
frank says to (16:59):
Dennis-this question is for anyone. What's working? Direct Mail?
Arthur Miller says to (16:59):
Newsletters what is your take on them? Both e-mail and snail mail
clarkev says to (17:00):
Hi Dennis, all. How # it is from direct mailing & the time involved on our hands?
scottvann says to (17:00):
with digital printing isn't the address printed on the card as well so you don't have to label them?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:00):
By storefront, I mean it's a web site you can access from any computer, type in your password, go to your account, type or compose the message, hit return, proof it, then hit return and your PowerKard will be mailed for you.
shelia01 says to (17:00):
e newsletters are working great for me Arthur. I send them to people over the country and I'm receiving calls now from people have investment property or looking to buy in my area based on my e newsletter
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:00):
The 10 Transactions Letters are on our Web site. I would contact jennifer.harris@hobbsherder.com for the web page and password.
JenandHannah says to (17:01):
Do you send newsletters to only people you know, or farms? How do you get the email address's?
clarkev says to (17:01):
Do we give u our farm database for u to mail the cards
shelia01 says to (17:02):
people I know, people I've made contact with in the past or I obtained their email address from lead generators. It takes time but the calls do come eventually.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:02):
Newsletters are something that is okay, but they are time intensive (if done right). That is, you don't want to send a generic newsletter, it should be branded and speak to your target market's lifestyle.
becky@beckyandbrad.net says to (17:02):
JenandHannah - you can actually go onto the US Post Office website and purchase addresses in certain farm groups from them...the only problem is they won't have their name...it will just have "Current Resident"
shelia01 says to (17:02):
I want to target single women but not sure how to reach them. Any suggestions on how to obtain contact information?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:02):
Clarkev: Yes, you send a data list, and it's uploaded and you can select that datalist or data lists and send your messages. It's very turnkey and keeps you focuse on being the "rain maker" and getting deals closed.
Nina says to (17:03):
You can get a farm from your Title cmpany and they will email it to you to use for your digital cards.
jnoble@cbhoa.com says to (17:03):
Is there any company that sells the names of the residents on your farm list?
JenandHannah says to (17:03):
We have done that. We were wondering if there was a way to get email address's that way.
scottvann says to (17:03):
could digital printing and variable data be used with our personal brochure as well?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:03):
becky: We discourage using "current resident," as I'm sure you are aware of. Often your title company will provide you with names. We can also sell you lists, call Patrick at ext. 903 for more information.
clarkev says to (17:04):
Are u using this right now Nina?
JenandHannah says to (17:04):
Yes. USADATA.com sells farm area lists with address's and names. Not to expensive either.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:04):
Jen and Hannah: There are companies that provide email addresses, those are more tricky and problematic, they need to be "scrubbed" often, that is, kept current so you don't become a spammer.
clarkev says to (17:05):
Tx JenandHannah for the info.
jbontempi says to (17:05):
What about using the tax records to get addresses of current owners in afarm?
shelia01 says to (17:05):
Make sure to include an unsubscribe link on emails
ShellyJ says to (17:05):
our title company got us a list and we go through it and update with the ones we know personally
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:05):
As far as data lists, you don't have to use current resident, because variable data gives you different areas on your power kard where you can personalize right to each h ome.
JenandHannah says to (17:05):
That works if you know the street names. It is time consuming. Buying the lists is worth the money and more accurate.
Babs says to (17:05):
Is there such a thing in Canada??
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:06):
Tax records are okay, check with your title company, they often provide for free .
Nina says to (17:06):
I'm using my Title Company and they elimate Current Resident.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:07):
Canada id different, Babs. You guys have a different system, "mail walk" i believe is what it is called. You may not have the option to personalize, but you can offset by expanding your farm/mailings, becuase it is so much cheaper. If only we could bring your health system to the US...
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:07):
;-)
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:07):
Current resident is not good, it undermines what you ar etyring to accomplish, building a rapport and a relationship through time.
clarkev says to (17:07):
My partner & I have been think about targeting some newer sub instead of some old with poor turnover rate. We'll check into this
shelia01 says to (17:08):
since technology is driving our business more and more, anyone have suggestions for good lead generators? what about search engine optimization? I know that would require daily updates to stay among the top ranks unless you pay per click. anyone had luck there?
scottvann says to (17:08):
can digital printing/variable data be used when mailing out your personal brochures as well?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:08):
Clarkev: switching markets is tricky, especially if you've been in there for a long time. Do the research on turnover and market share. Don't just jump on a whim. It's a process built over time.
Nina says to (17:09):
I agree with Shelia, the internet ihas become one of the best ways to advertise and reach clients and prospective clients.
JenandHannah says to (17:09):
Has anyone had luck with ads. We are finding it is hard to run ads inexpensively with any success.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:10):
Scottvann: Not really on the personal brochures. We recommend not printing the brochures digitally, they need to be printed in large quantities. There is the possibility of doing variable data on the envelopes, but not sure if we provide that yet
Babs says to (17:10):
I agree with thaT ALSO. cLIENTS SEEM MORE WILLING TO REPLY TO EMAILS AS APPOSED TO THE TELEPHONE.
ShellyJ says to (17:10):
we really only advertise in one magazine
ShellyJ says to (17:10):
we dont get enough calls from the ads to make it worthwhile
Nina says to (17:10):
How do we access power kards?
clarkev says to (17:11):
I agree. What do u recommend in our case since @ least 1/3 - 1/4 have been very slow in the past 4-6 months
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:11):
Jen and Hannah: Ads are tricky. They are hit or miss, and usually better for larger areas. Direct Mail is your best option. Not many agents know that we can send ads through the mail on oversize powerkards. It has the power of a display ad, but the laser focus of direct mail. You can send these on large 8.5 x 11 size PKs and they are powerful, not too expensive
becky@beckyandbrad.net says to (17:12):
just to be clear on the digital printing: We can send Hobbs Herder info we want on a power kard each month or however often we do it, and they can print that up for us? How do we go about doing this?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:12):
Nina, what do you mean by access powerkards?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:12):
Becky: I'll have someone call you to walk you through digital printing. Please email me offline your information to: dennis.leblanc@hobbsherder.com
Nina says to (17:13):
Where can I see them and what are they? Do we write our own script or are there messages on the cards. Can you personalize them?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:13):
Becky, not only print it for you, but mail it too. We are competitively priced, you'd be surprised at how economical it is.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:14):
Nina, I can have someone contact you too, on the digital printing. Don't want to turn this chat into a commercial. send me your contact info: dennis.leblanc@Hobbsherder.com/
jnoble@cbhoa.com says to (17:15):
Does Hobbs and Herder have to design the powerkard for you...or can we do that ourselves and just have you print and send?
jbontempi says to (17:15):
Dennis: I don't have my materials finished yet, but It seems like a "no -Brainer" to use digital printing for the powercards
Nina says to (17:15):
I have to leave in a few minutes for an appointment. I've enjoyed the time in the chat room. Talk with you next months.
JenandHannah says to (17:15):
We are using it for the 90 day plan. We are using it to print letters to go with our brochure and the system inputs all the names and prints them up & mails to us. It is really easy to use.
clarkev says to (17:15):
And again Dennis how # are they from the direct mailing? The major # & our own time involvement?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:15):
Nina, we have messages posted online to give you guidelines, you personalize with your listed or sold info. There are ad messages too you can send.
Babs says to (17:16):
I would like to ask a question or two.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:16):
Jenand Hannah, cool. I'm glad it's easy to use, that's our goal.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:16):
Babs, jump right in, it's a little crazy, but I'll try and get to your questions.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:16):
Any other questions I've not addressed? Please restate them if so.
Babs says to (17:16):
What would you recommend as an insert for a Military Publication?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:17):
Nina, thanks for being on the chat.
clarkev says to (17:17):
And again Dennis how # are they from the direct mailing? The major # & our own time involvement?
Babs says to (17:17):
My next question is about 100 Best Ads. In order to change or customize the ad is further software required?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:18):
Babs, I take it you are working a military data list? If you have an H/H Houseflier, you could put a marketing message on that, otherwise, an ad tailored to your target market's needs (relocation?) would be fine.
shelia01 says to (17:18):
It references you have to buy Adobe Pagemaker to edit. Will Adobe CS 2?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:18):
Clarkev, not sure what you mean?
Babs says to (17:20):
Thanks for your reply to my first question. The second one...is that software that can be shared?
shelia01 says to (17:20):
I believe you can purchase multiple licenses. If you go to adobe.com you can download a 30 day trial version of page maker before you buy
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:21):
100 Best ads require Adobe InDesign. CS2 will work. But here's a key point. While you can personalize them yourself, remember what you learn at our seminar. You are the rainmaker, you are not your marketing person or assistant. They are best utilized by giving a copy of the disk to a graphic designer or the publication you want to run in, and let them know how you want it personalized. My recommendation is not to buy InDesign, it's expensive and you should not be doing that graphic design work. It's also a complicated program. If you want to learn it, that's fine. But it's better to give it to someone else to do
shelia01 says to (17:21):
It's around $500-600 to purchase I think. Office depot might be cheaper to adjust not sure
jcrews12 says to (17:21):
what are two things that will set a realtor from other realtors
jbontempi says to (17:22):
Dennis: Great advice! The last thing I need is to learn a new program.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:22):
100 Best ads is a cool product, the value is incredible. However, I urge you not to try and learn InDesign, it's not your best use of time. REmember, be "dollar productive!" do stuff that will make you money directly, all other stuff delegate!!!!
jcrews12 says to (17:22):
two things that will set a realtor APART
Babs says to (17:22):
Thank you for the information. Another question For the RLP convention welcome bags. What do you recommend adding to these bags?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:23):
jcrews: If you are a H/H client, t hen it's your branding, your brochurea nd your PowerKard. You stand for something in the consumer's minds. You don't look like just another realtor. KEy though, is to get it out to t he public.
becky@beckyandbrad.net says to (17:23):
where can I find info on 100 Best Ads?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:24):
Becky, you can order that on Hobbsherder.com. Again, email me offline and I can have someone contact you.
admin says to (17:24):
Try this link for 100 best ads:
http://www.hobbsherder.com/marketing_products_100best.asp
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:25):
Babs, can you elaborate on t he RLP convention thing? ARe you with Royal LePage Atlantic?
jbontempi says to (17:25):
What about Personal Speaking engagements? How does one do that & how can that be used to gain business?
scottvann says to (17:25):
is the 100 best ads something we can use before we get our marketing program going?
Babs says to (17:25):
Question: For Sale By Owner (FSOB) Package drop off... what do you suggest for these packages?
shelia01 says to (17:25):
is it possible to buy folders, gift bags, pens, etc. from HH with my branding?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:26):
Personal speaking engagements are powerful lead generating activities. It allows you an opportunity to pass out your personal brochure to a captive audience who you have had a chance to connect with. Powerful.
JenandHannah says to (17:26):
we use the 29 steps booklet customized with our look to give to fsbos.
jbontempi says to (17:26):
Yes, but what do I talk about?
clarkev says to (17:26):
Is it less time consuming than direct mail & who's doing the mailing?
Babs says to (17:26):
Yes I am with Royal LePage Atlantic. When we have the conventions there is a gift bag. Each agent adds something to the bag. I was just wondering if HobbsHerder recommends anything?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:26):
If you are doing a seminar or talk on first time home buying, for example, that is a great opportunity to get leads and get their emails and contact info. Do the follow up on that list though!!!!!!!!!!
Babs says to (17:28):
We do use 29 steps, just wondering what else you might suggest
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:28):
jbontempi: REAL ESTATE! workshops on real estate investing. First Time buyers. How to go from renting to buying a home and Save money! The possibiilities are endless
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:29):
The critical thing with speaking engagements is to promote it or no one will attend. YOur PowerKard is an excellent vehicle to do so, and you will be marketing yourself. Your House flier will be good to. Another good topic is to speak to seniors about their needs, downsizing, empty nest, reverse mortgages etc.
scottvann says to (17:29):
is the 100 Best Ads something we can use to jump start our marketing prior to getting our Hobbs Herder marketing in place and up to speed?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:30):
Babs, we strongly recommend that you don't use any type of gimmicky trinkets in those bags. If you can put your personal brochure, that would be best!
jbontempi says to (17:30):
Dennis: Is that something I set up, or are there groups I should approach; eg: church groups, rotary, etc?
Babs says to (17:30):
Thanks, that is what I wanted to know.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:31):
Scottvann: that is a very good question. You can use the 100 best ads, but it might be better just to continue what you are currently doing until you get your materials. Most important: DON'T STOP MARKETING WHILE YOU ARE WAITING!!!!!!!!!!
JenandHannah says to (17:31):
For the 90 day plan, if we are a team, do you recommend doubling the numbers in the plan?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:32):
Jbontempi: Network it!!!! Explore your opportunities. Church groups are awesome. Rotary is great. Local community centers. A gated community might have a clubhouse. Could you speak there? You could rent a room and promote it, but you can't do it half-heartedly. YOu have to in vest in some promotion.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:33):
Jen and Hannah: No, you don't have to double the numbers. Even though you are a team, you are marketing the same group and branding yourself as a team to these people. Unless you are not a true team and you work separately.
shelia01 says to (17:33):
can HH print presentation folders with my branding to give at listing presentations or buyer tour packages? Otherwise I continue to use my company folders?
jbontempi says to (17:33):
Dennis: Good ideas. Thanks.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:33):
Any questions I"ve missed?
Babs says to (17:34):
After we have completed the series of HH letters to clients, what do you recommend to do after that??
sal says to (17:34):
Scott VanThe power card has worked well for my wife and I. We have a local printer put a particular message on the card and mail to the niche market we intend to hit. Just recently we had two listings appointments set as a result of the quality of the kard. We landed a 457k listing and once sold, will pay for all of the Hobbs Herder expenses thus far. Great piece and great results
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:34):
WE can do presentation folders that carry your branding. I recommend these over your company folders, but it's a budgetary issue. If you can afford it, do it. LEt me know if you would like a quote. email me.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:35):
Babs, you need to go into maintenance mode. I believe you are talking about the 10 transactions plan? If so, then you should be intrroducing your Powerkard mailings.
JenandHannah says to (17:35):
We are having trouble understanding the purpose of the media releases in the 90 day plan. What is the objective here? Just getting our name out or something else?
Babs says to (17:36):
Thank you Dennis. You have been very helpful, appreciate it.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:36):
The media releases are to develop a relationship with the local real estaet editors. You want to try and position yourseelf as a local real estate expert. They may contact you for a quote or a take. It's a long shot, but you should be working every angle.
JenandHannah says to (17:37):
Ok that makes sense. They wouldnt run our press release, but they put us in as real estate resource for the paper. That would make sense.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:37):
Jenand Hannah: Also, you want them to publish your release. In some smaller towns and communities, you have a better chance. The New York Times may not provide that big an opportunity.
JenandHannah says to (17:38):
Every paper that we have contacted wont run it, because they see it as an advertisement.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:38):
Babs, if you don't have the PowerKard primer "How to Turn your Direct Mail into a powerful Lead generating..." then email me offline and I'll send you a link to a digital version of that. It has all the different PowerKard mailing plans/schedules.
JenandHannah says to (17:38):
So far they are only willing to run it in the classifieds, unless we pay for a full ad, which is expensive.
sal says to (17:39):
Jenn and Hanna, see if your paper has a business breif section, they ran our info after attending gateway.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:39):
JenandHannah, yes, this is common. But again, personal marketing is anumbers game. YOu have to work every angle and pursue every opportunity. YOu need to find a way to pass out 100 to 200 of your personal brochures to different people each month, in addition to your mailings.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:40):
sal, yes, in some c ommunities, you can have this happen. You just have to follow through and send it, then maybe even call for follow up.
Babs says to (17:40):
Dennis what email address do I use to contact you?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:41):
dennis.leblanc@hobbsherder.com is my email address.
JenandHannah says to (17:41):
That part we can do. The newspapers around here are a little odd. We sent it out to all the ones that would accept it, but they all had different reasons they wouldnt run it.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:41):
Any other challenges or questions? How is the market in your area?
JenandHannah says to (17:42):
Market is slowing down in Salt Lake City after 2 years of strong growth. Still good though. Economy is strong. Lots of new construction. Is there a good way to market to builders?
shelia01 says to (17:42):
in Miami 2 years inventory single family homes almost 3 years of condos. Properties are moving just getting sellers to be realistic and getting buyers off the fence. Lots of agents so the personal branding is what I need to differentiate
sal says to (17:42):
northern MI is tough right now, many agents are using old data on listing appointments and giving sellers the idea that properties are valued higher than our analysis is coming in at, any suggestions on not bidding for the listing?
Babs says to (17:43):
New construction market in Nova Scotia is terrific.
jbontempi says to (17:43):
In Nashville, the market has tempered a little, but the economy here is strong & there are some major businesses relocating here,, so things are pretty good.
JenandHannah says to (17:43):
show them the "real" data. Sellers are smart, they will see through the false numbers.
shelia01 says to (17:43):
sal continue to push it is a buyers market. real estate is a commodity not a product. Buyers dictate the pricing
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:43):
Jenand Hannah: Here is a more complicated part of the "media/press release" area: You can watch your local farm area and city for unique story angles, such as an old lady who you helped sell her house, maybe she's 99 and has lived a good life, has an interesting story, you can always "pitch" the story to the local editors, it doesn't have to be the real estate editor, the lifestyle section editor would be better. There is slight chance that t hey are interested in doing the story and they would more than likely interview you for a quote.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:44):
Babs, work the smaller builders and developers. Give them a copy of your brochure and take them t o lunch to pitch them on referring clients who have to sell their home to buy the new home to you!
JenandHannah says to (17:45):
good ideas. We are trying to get in to the business spotlight section.
sal says to (17:46):
We have focused on the motivated seller and buyer. The "just wanna see what we can get" can list with the other agents. That has seemed to cut the days on market.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:46):
Everybody: if the market is slow in your area, NOW is the time to do your personal marketing STRONG! Agents are droppingout of the business. When the market turns, you will be way ahead of the pack and stand to gain lots of busines because your name is out there!!! it's critical to understand. It's counterintuitive to some, because lack of transactions hurts your cash flow, but it's a great time to market yourself!!!!
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:47):
JenandHannah: just watch the type of articles they do on local residents. I"m sure you run into people with interesting stories.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:47):
Sal, any tricks you are using to determine who the motivated ones are???
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:48):
Our philosophy is that the quality of your personal brochure will help you gain more credibility to work with better clients, gives yuo more credibility to ask for the price reductions, etc.
sal says to (17:49):
Just asking what is the motivation to list your home. Using open ended questioning with little pressure, guide them with your questioning to get the answers you need to determine if they are someone you want to form a relationship with.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:49):
Sorry for the typos, guys. I''m trying to answer as many questions as possible.
JenandHannah says to (17:49):
We had someone tell us the other day in response to seeing our brochure" Wow, when you see this, you think, if they made the effort to put something like this together, what will they do for selling our house" The brochure works!
Babs says to (17:50):
I am signing off now. It was very informative. Nice to meet you all.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:50):
Sal, thanks for sharing with the group. Questions are th emost powerful tool. Drill down, find out all you can, it gives you more leverage. People love to talk about themselves, and they will divulge way more info about them than they should if you get them talking about themselves. YOu have to appear genuine. You have to snap out of the "close them now" mode.
sal says to (17:50):
As for buyers the same is true, align yourself with local companies human resource dept. I worked my way into the local hospital and am now working with Physicians candidates and other professionals. Just closed one this week with a new general surgeon. It is working well.
sal says to (17:51):
Dennis I agree, make them feel like they are the most important thing on the planet. Be yourself and genuine.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:51):
Sal, you got it going on!!! Networking is key and your personal brochure is your best weapon there. It gives you instant c redibility with even doctors...a tough group.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:52):
Phil Herman is my client, and I work with him. He's got a data list of doctors he markets. It's targeted niche marketing.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:52):
I've enjoyed chatting with you, trying to keep up. just a few more minutes any last questions or thoughts?
JenandHannah says to (17:53):
sal- how did you approach the hospital? Human resources? did you know someone? We have a huge brand new hospital here, we have been trying to figure out how to approach it.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:53):
Good question Jenand Hannah. Phone calls, inquiries, mailing y our personal brochure are good steps (with a very strategic cover letter). Sal, any thing to share?
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:54):
You can take the decision maker to lunch? There are many ways to get inroads to decision makers, some more tough and requiring more persistance.
JenandHannah says to (17:54):
how would we go about getting address's? I would imagine they protect the doctors info.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:55):
You can purchase lists. Doctor lists are very hard to get. I believe many sources just "rent" the list. That is, they don't provide you with the list, they facilitate the mailing for you. But think outside this box, what other groups can you go after? City workers? Police, fire?
sal says to (17:55):
I was interviewed to act as a buyers agent for the vice pres of personel services, I assisted them in purchasing 40 acres to build their home on, then the call came from the physicians recruiter and have been getting calls for nearly two years now. Perhaps hitting some of the fund raisers that are sure to happen in the near furute, show interest in the community. Generally I take the candidate for a community tour of schools, local points of interest and form a bond with them. Sell them on your community and then work into the Realtor position.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:56):
B2B online is a good resource to search for lists.
JenandHannah says to (17:56):
Police is another one. Hard to get contact info.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:56):
Sal is right on. You have to get your foot in the door. Fundraisers, donations, etc.
Dennis LeBlanc says to (17:57):
Okay everyone, I'll be signing off now. I enjoyed it immensely. Hope to get another opportunity soon., John Surge will be holding the next chat on the third thursday in August. Take care.
clarkev says to (17:58):
Appreciate this Dennis. Bye all
sal says to (17:58):
We are rural northern mi with no malls and big cities, the hospital pays lots of $$ to get the candidates here and they know my passsion for the area and wanted me to sell them on the area so the people have a true perception or the area.
admin says to (17:59):
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